August 02, 2007
Nation of Laws?
Is this country a nation of laws or a nation of men?
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Is "intent" a portion of the law, or not?
In one case, we have massive "hate crimes" that punish thoughts. In another, we punish "intentions." But sometimes, depending on the political correctness of the crime, apparently, we punish based solely on actions, with no regard to intent.
So how in the world does one obey the laws and not get in trouble today in America? Do and think only what you are told, when you are told it. How is that not scary as hell?
As has been said throughout the ages:
In an unjust nation, the place of a just man is in jail.
Posted by: Ogre at
01:06 PM
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Post contains 123 words, total size 1 kb.
1
People in the U.S. are not punished for their THOUGHTS -- I wish I could grab Alberto Gonzalez by the throat and strangle him for his trampling of our Constitution!
People are punished if they commit a CRIME. If a prosecutor could prove beyond a reasonable doubt to 12 citizen-peers that someone killed Gonzalez because they just HATE Mexicans then the punishment could be more severe than the death penalty :-)
The intent is to discourage people from racial or ethnic violence. I have no idea if "hate crime" laws stop hatred.
Posted by: RFK at August 02, 2007 02:58 PM (jACyb)
2
I disagree. The fellow who dropped a Koran in the toilet is not being punished for his actions. His action was to drop a book in a toilet. If I drop a book in a toilet, that's not a crime -- it's just a book in a toilet. Therefore, since he's being charged with TWO felonies, he's being punished for his thoughts -- or other people's perceptions of his thoughts.
Posted by: Ogre at August 02, 2007 03:01 PM (oifEm)
3
Well, I was thinking of a different example. Two neighbors had been fueding with each other for years and one hot summer Sunday afternoon one guy got his pistol and shot his neighbor to death. he was charged with one of those murder crimes -- not pre-meditated, but spontaneous and emotional.
Two other neighbors had trouble because one was gay and the other was a homophobe (is that what you call a person who HATES gay people?). One hot summer afternoon the gay guy was mowing his lawn and the neighbor shouted some obscenities at him and then ran over and started punching the guy in the face. He was charged with assault AND a hate crime. I suppose his jail sentence was a little bit longer than it would have been if he had just lost his temper during an argument.
So I see a difference ... trying to discourage people from doing hateful acts.
Posted by: M . L . King at August 02, 2007 10:28 PM (Bn7Z6)
4
I disagree. Why should someone be punished more because of how they feel?
Posted by: Ogre at August 02, 2007 11:15 PM (GYzrk)
5
I don't trot out Atlas Shrugged quotes lightly, but this seems appropriate (and my apologies for the length):
"Did you really think that we want those laws to be observed?" said Dr. Ferris. "We want them
broken [...] There's no way to rule innocent men. The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws. Who wants a nation of law-abiding citizens? What's there in that for anyone? But just pass the kind of laws that can neither be observed nor enforced nor objectively interpreted - and you create a nation of
law-breakers - and then you cash in on guilt. Now that's the system, Mr. Rearden, that's the
game, and once you understand it, you'll be much easier to deal with."
Posted by: Harvey at August 04, 2007 03:57 AM (L7a63)
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Damn, you just had to bring that one out, didn't you?
Can I move to Galt's Gulch now?
Posted by: Ogre at August 06, 2007 11:16 AM (oifEm)
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